Hi Folks,
A common question is what are true clone movements? And why is it important?
Here's a detailed analysis and answer.
The Three F's Methodology
When looking at true clone movements, we distinguish them from other reliable movements. Namely, movements the clone the style but not the substance, and generic Swiss and Japanese movements.
Using our three f's methodology, we can distinguish a true clone movement if it correspond with following parameters:
Form
Function
Franken
Form
The main aspects we look for when inspecting the form are the movements overall diameter, placement of holes for dial installation, and dimensions hands pin for hand installation.
For example, let's build a hypothetical Rolex 41mm Submariner replica watch. The movement we choose is a Swiss made workhorse: the ETA 2824-2. Now we want to install the movement into either Gen or Clone Rolex 41mm Submariner watch case that is intended to house the 3235 movement. Common misconception assumes that it is a pretty straightforward process, but it's not the case.
Looking into the specs of both movements we find out that the 3235 movement diameter is 28.5mm and the ETA 2824-2 diameter is 25.6mm. This means that we need to put the ETA movement in a special frame (usually made from plastic), whose outer diameter fit the Rolex Submariner case and inner diameter fit the ETA movement.
Set aside, the aesthetics aspect of opening the caseback and seeing that the movement sits in a plastic frame, it's important but it's not the end of the world.
What is much more important is that in order to install the hands and dial on the movement we now need to source a Rolex mockup dial and hands that are made specifically for the ETA movement. By this point the hypothetical watch we're building is far from being a super clone. It's just a nice solid replica watch with Swiss made workhorse movement.
Function
We continue to build our hypothetical watch, now we find out that the ETA 2824-2 we used is not exactly on par with the Rolex 3235 movement in the way that it function. The power reserve of the ETA is 38 hours, the 3235 power reserve is 72 hours, and the date mechanism is different and doesn't jump quite like it does in the 3235 etc. You get the picture. Again a solid watch with a Swiss made workhorse movement that looks like a Rolex and that's it pretty much.
Franken
Franken is short for Frankenstein, drawing on the logic of the famous story written by Mary Shelley. Franken refers to creating a holistic functional "thing" a Rolex watch in our case from parts from different origins.
Franken watches encapsulate the pinnacle of the truly amazing raw potential that true clone movements offer. But before going any further, there's a disclaimer I have to make. The process of getting parts and upgrading a true clone movement is long and costly! Moreover, by no means is it a necessary endeavor to take. Franken watches are reserved to seasoned collectors and fanatics, and they are usually those who venture into Franken watches.
With that out of the way, let's get back to the movement we referred to in our examples throughout this post - the Rolex 3235. Now the Rolex 3235 has only one true clone movement, the VS3235.
Thus, we have our VS3235 movement as our base. How can we Franken it? A common part swap on this movement is to replace the balance complete, pallet fork, and escape wheel with gen parts. With those parts swapped, the movement is virtually indistinguishable from the genuine caliber.
Assuming you can actually get gen parts:
The balance complete will set you back about 800usd, pallet fork about 250usd, and escape wheel about 150usd, paying a watchmaker to assemble everything let's say about 300usd for the work.
Again assuming you can actually get gen parts and find a decent watchmaker who's up for the challenge we're talking about a total of about 1500usd investment, nearly three times the price price of VSF Submariner.
We add our VSF Submariner to the total and we're above the 2000usd mark for a Franken watch.
Another Franken option is to make the parts by yourself, or by ordering a custom made parts. This can be either easier or more difficult it depends. But basically it means that you either find a professional that work with CNC and 3D printing and hope that he can produce the parts for you.
This also can be very costly but it's hard to guess how much it will cost. Hence, there are many variables to consider, for instance if you don't have a computer file of the parts 3D modeling, you'll probably have to pay someone to produce them, again it's hard to tell how much that will cost.
The leading true clone movements
The investments into true clone movements corresponds with the most popular models from the most popular brand. Namely, Rolex.
The leading factory of true clone Rolex movement is the Dangdong factory from China.
The Dangdong factory produces:
The VS3135 movement we find in VSF 40mm Submariners and 40mm YachtMasters etc.
The VS3235 movement we find in VSF 41mm Submariners, Datejusts and YachtMasters.
The DD3285 we find in new generation of the Clean Factory GMT master II
The A4130 Chronograph we find in Daytonas from Clean Factory, BTF etc.
VS3135 & VS3130
This is an excellent movement. The part finishing quality and engraving is good. The hairspring mounted clockwise. This is the best clone of the Rolex 3135 movement. Note, there is a VS3130 version of this movement which is used on the no-date 40mm VSF subs (ref number 114060). The VS3130 is of equal quality to the VS3135, it is the best option for a no-date 40mm sub.
For identification against the genuine and other clone 3135 movements, note the position of the beat adjustor arm and the regulator arm. Note the type and quality of the balance shock absorber setting. Note that there's a difference between the VS3135 used in VSF watches and the VS3135 used in CF watches: the version used in CF watches doesn't have a serial number engraved into the main plate.
This movement used to be exclusive to VS Factory (VSF).
VS3235
This is an incredible movement that is currently only available in VS Factory (VSF) subs and DJs. The movement has an amazing 70+ hour power reserve and is part compatible with the genuine Rolex movement. This means that it’s possible to swap gen parts into this movement to improve it. A common part swap on this movement is to replace the balance complete, pallet fork, and escape wheel with gen parts. With those parts swapped, the movement is virtually indistinguishable from the genuine caliber.
For identifications of this movement, look at the position of the two arms coming off the balance bridge on the VS movement they face outwards. Also note the paraflex shock setting spring. The paraflex shock setting on the VS3235 movement is the actual functional shock setting, unlike on the VR3235 where the paraflex shock setting is simply a decoration plate.
Note: there is currently no non-date version of the VS3235, that is a "VS3230" movement doesn't exist (as of March 2023).
DD3285
For GMT movements, there are movements that have the correct hand stack (CHS) and incorrect hand stack (ICHS) on modern (6-digit) GMT models (1167XX, and 1267XX). Correct hand stack means that the hour hand is on the bottom, the GMT hand is next, then the minute hand, and the seconds hand is on top. Incorrect Hand Stack means that the GMT hand is on the bottom, the hour hand is on top of the GMT hand, then the minute hand, and the seconds hand on top.
The DD3285 is a new movement from Dandong movement factory (one of the best rep movement factories in China). This movement is currently exclusive to Clean Factory (CF). Based on the photo comparison posted above the DD3285 appears to be based on the excellent VS3235 movement, so it is likely that it will have the long 70 hour power reserve.
This movement can be easily distinguished from the different movements by the position of the beat adjustor arm, and regulator arm which both point outwards and are very similar to the VS3235 movement from which the DD3285 is based. Also note the functional paraflex shock setting and that the rotor runs on ball bearings unlike other clones of the gmt movement.
DD4130
For Daytona movements,
the best is the original Dandong 4130 movement used by Noob (until Noob was shut down in a raid in 2021), and now used by CF, BTF, QF, and "new Noob".
Dandong 4130 (aka DD4130 or "Noob 4130")
This movement is also known as the Noob4130 / N4130 / Dandong 4130. They are all the same.
This movement is one of the highest quality replica movements available. For a long time it was exclusively available to Noob Factory. When Noob was raided and shut down in 2021, this movement disappeared from the rep scene. However, in early 2022 Clean Factory (CF), and then Better Factory (BTF), and Q Factory (QF) started making Daytonas with this movement.
The DD4130 movement is also compatible with genuine Rolex parts. It’s common to replace the balance-complete, and the chronograph seconds wheel to build a movement that is nearly indistinguishable from the genuine Rolex caliber 4130.
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